Cryptinae with thickened antenna segments > Schenkia?

Cryptinae with thickened antenna segments > Schenkia?

Postby Lennart Bendixen on 12 Mar 2017, 10:50

Hello everyone,

I couldn't find any species with that kind of antennae yet – who knows which genus this is?

Thanks in advance, Lennart

Length about 7 mm. 2016-10-01, Northern Germany, S-H, Mohrkirch, house wall (northside)
P3240262.JPG
P3240257mm7g Cryptinae.JPG
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P3240264.JPG
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P3240267.JPG
Last edited by Lennart Bendixen on 15 Mar 2017, 15:33, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Cryptinae with thickened antenna segments

Postby Bilule on 14 Mar 2017, 20:41

Nice antennae indeed!
The only two genera which such antennae I found in Townes are Giraudia and Schenkia.
But saying that is close to saying nothing, sorry.
Let's wait for experts :)
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Re: Cryptinae with thickened antenna segments

Postby Gunnar on 14 Mar 2017, 22:05

I have been searching for this one too, and I think that Schenkia is a very good guess. After what I can find it fits best with Schenkia graminicola (petiolus red). But I have no key for all of them available (we can hope for Schwarz to enter some views).
Schenkia:
Apical half (or apical 40 %) of female flagellum strongly flattened below and strongly tapered to the apex. Upper face of propodeum long, its median carinae subparallel, bounding an elongate subrectangular area (or the median carinae sometimes lacking). Sternaulus about 0.3 to 0.6 as long as mesopleurum.

If this one is collected it should be possible to decide if this female is Schenkia or not.
I attach the drawing of Schenkia graminicola from Townes.
Attachments
Schenkia graminicola tegning Townes.jpg
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Re: Cryptinae with thickened antenna segments

Postby Lennart Bendixen on 15 Mar 2017, 08:11

Many thanks to both of you!

What do you use, is that "The Genera of Ichneumonidae Pt 2 - Gelinae", 1969? Any chance to find it online?

It is not collected. Theoretically Schenkia would fit very well, but there's sth. that confuses me: If I had drawn the antennae, they would look different. What I called "thickened" is not visible in the drawing - well, the flattening / tapering is, but all flagellomeres seem to be almost of the same size dorsoventrally, whereas in my pictures it varies distinctly. Or is that an illusion? :?
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Re: Cryptinae with thickened antenna segments

Postby Gunnar on 15 Mar 2017, 10:00

Yes, I use The genera of Ichneumonidae, part 2. I have bought them (part 1 - 4) from David Wahl at The American Entomological Institute:
http://www.amentinst.org/home.php
I guess that I am not allowed to share them (but I share some drawings). They are not textscanned and are very big (677 mB for part 2).

It is not possible to get to genera with most Cryptinae without looking at many small details. You have to collect them and look at them under a stereo microscope. And even then most of the species are to difficult to ID without years of trying and failing, and a growing reference collection. That is why there are probably not more than a handfull of people in the world that are specialists on Cryptinae.

The keys and drawings in Townes are very usefull, but even when you get to the right genus, you will stop there due to lack of new revisions.
I (and probably also Bilule) have studied the drawings in Townes (as well as pictures on Bold systems) to find a Cryptinae with that much flattened and dilated flagellomeres as the one on your pictures, without success.

You will probably have to get help from an expert to come any further with this one.
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Re: Cryptinae with thickened antenna segments

Postby Lennart Bendixen on 15 Mar 2017, 15:33

Thanks for the link (maybe I'll need it one day) and thanks for the warning about using it! ;)

Would be great to have Martin Schwarz's opinion on this.
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