GE1447 Polytribax arrogans M Southern Norway

GE1447 Polytribax arrogans M Southern Norway

Postby Gunnar on 18 Feb 2017, 22:38

More pictures of this male Polytribax arrogans (Cryptinae, Hemigasterini) posted today on the Norwegian Artsobservasjoner:
https://www.artsobservasjoner.no/Image/730449

It is 10,8 mm long, found on a seashore meadow.
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GE1447 Polytribax arrogans ansikt redusert.jpg
GE1447 Polytribax arrogans redusert.jpg
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Re: GE1447 Polytribax arrogans M Southern Norway

Postby Bilule on 18 Feb 2017, 23:34

Hi Gunnar,
How do you separate arrogans from other species?
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Re: GE1447 Polytribax arrogans M Southern Norway

Postby Gunnar on 19 Feb 2017, 10:11

In Norway we have 4 species of Polytribax.
I have written how to exclude the 3 other Nordic species of male Polytribax in Norwegian in Artsobservasjoner.no.
You can exclude two of them from this picture only:

https://www.artsobservasjoner.no/Image/730453

You can also check pictures of males on boldsystems:
http://www.boldsystems.org/index.php/Ta ... xid=502844

Polytribax perspicillator has red gaster, with black petiolus. It has hind legs with even tarsus 5 white (except the claws). In addition it has more extensive white drawings on the face. (boldsystems: http://www.boldsystems.org/index.php/Ta ... xid=746467)
Take a look at this one (Det. M. Schwarz).
http://faunearthropode.fr/polytribaxperspicillator.html

Polytribax rufipes has red hind femora and hind tarsus without white.
Polytribax picticornis has antennae with white ring.

Two other southern species in Europe (senex and pelinocheirus) have not been considered. They are known as far north as Germany.

You can find the Nordic species described here, with latin text:
Thomson, C.G. 1883. XXXI. Forsok till gruppering och beskrifning af Crypti (fortsattning). Opuscula Entomologica. Lund. IX:850-872.

Polytribax arrogans: Niger abdomine rufo, basi apiceque nigro: mas tarsis posticis ante apicem albis. Ej sallsynt, men honan förekommer sparsamt.
Poplytribax perspicillator: Niger, abdomine basi excepta rufo, pedibus posticis nigris, genubus testaceis, orbita frontali maris interiore et ore albidis.
(it is a great advantage to have had language as one of my greates hobbies since I was 20, but google translate does incredible work for me to)

I guess there are work to be done with Polytribax as there are no new revisions, but my male matches the description of arrogans in all details.
It would be great if Martin Schwarz could share some comments here.
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Re: GE1447 Polytribax arrogans M Southern Norway

Postby Bilule on 19 Feb 2017, 18:18

Many thanks for your detailed answer.
Do your confirm that your specimen has the scutellum entirely black?
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Re: GE1447 Polytribax arrogans M Southern Norway

Postby Gunnar on 19 Feb 2017, 18:31

Yes, scutellum is entirely black, except for a minute creamwhite spot near apex that you can see in this picture:
https://www.artsobservasjoner.no/Image/730456
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Re: GE1447 Polytribax arrogans M Southern Norway

Postby Bilule on 19 Feb 2017, 19:03

Thanks and sorry, I didn't noticed it with the arowed spiracle.
So my specimen is quite similar to yours. But unfortunatly I didn't find any description of pelinocheirus, so I can't conclude.
Anyway, thanks again for your help.
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Re: GE1447 Polytribax arrogans M Southern Norway

Postby Gunnar on 19 Feb 2017, 21:31

You can try to translate this from Granvenhorst 1829 (his description is based on two males) for Polytribax pelinocheirus (Cryptus p.):

Segmentis 2 - 4 rufis; tibiis anticis subtus testaceis. m.
Antennae porrectae setaceae, dimidio corpore longiores. Thorax gibbulus, puncto infra scutellum albo. Scutellum macula apicali alba. Alae fumatohyalinae, radio stigmate et squamula nigris, radice alba; areola quinqueangulari. Pedes elongati subgraciles nigri; tibiis anticis subtestaceis, externe fuscis. Abdomen capitis thoracisque longitudine vel paulo longius, thorace angustius; segmento 1 nigro, subcanaliculato, apice rufo, petiolo lineari, parte antica longitudine latiore, aequilata, breviore et paulo latiore quam petiolus; 2 - 4 rufis; 5 obscurorufo aut nigro; 6 et 7 nigris.
(the translation to Norwegian is not very good on google translate).

He does not at all mention white hind tarsi, and the legs seems to be darker than arrogans. Scutellum macula apicali alba (apex of scutellum with white spot).
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Re: GE1447 Polytribax arrogans M Southern Norway

Postby Bilule on 20 Feb 2017, 01:14

It looks like what we call in french "latin de cuisine" (i.e. the latin spoken in kichen, not good latin) :lol:
I've found (but not read yet) descriptions in german in:
Die Schlupwespenfamilie Cryptides (Gen. V. Cryptus Gr.) mit besonderer Berücksichtigung des deutschen Arten", von E.L. Tashenberg; 1865;
Gesammten Naturwissenschaften; N°1-2 Januar und Februar 1865

C. arrogans page 86 and C. pelinocheirus p. 87 here in BHL.

Do you have any of the value of this paper?
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Re: GE1447 Polytribax arrogans M Southern Norway

Postby Gunnar on 20 Feb 2017, 11:07

Thank you very much, Bilule!
Is seems to be a very good work for further Cryptinae-study, when new revisions are not at hand. It has even got a reasonably good key.
Both the key and the descriptions confirm my arrogans male.
I hope you can use it to get the best ID so far possible for your Polytribax-male.
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Re: GE1447 Polytribax arrogans M Southern Norway

Postby D & JP Balmer on 26 Feb 2017, 05:50

Bilule wrote:It looks like what we call in french "latin de cuisine" (i.e. the latin spoken in kichen, not good latin) :lol:
I've found (but not read yet) descriptions in german in:
Die Schlupwespenfamilie Cryptides (Gen. V. Cryptus Gr.) mit besonderer Berücksichtigung des deutschen Arten", von E.L. Tashenberg; 1865;
Gesammten Naturwissenschaften; N°1-2 Januar und Februar 1865

C. arrogans page 86 and C. pelinocheirus p. 87 here in BHL.

Do you have any of the value of this paper?

Bonjour Bilule,
Il m' avait semblé que "latin de cuisine" était la désignation du Français issu du latin des Légionnaires Romains ayant conquis la Gaule?
Très Cordialement.
D & JP Balmer
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Re: GE1447 Polytribax arrogans M Southern Norway

Postby Camille Thirion on 26 Feb 2017, 15:17

Cf Schwarz : Polytribax arrogans
My answer from Schwarz did not stay!
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Re: GE1447 Polytribax arrogans M Southern Norway

Postby Gunnar on 27 Feb 2017, 10:10

Thank your very much for your confirmations, Camille and Martin!
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